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	<title>Comments on: Unexpectedly modern</title>
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	<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/</link>
	<description>Tangled musings on identity, privacy, trust, and suchlike</description>
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		<title>By: Eve M.</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1936</link>
		<dc:creator>Eve M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Nov 2005 20:45:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/archives/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/#comment-1936</guid>
		<description>Ben-- Thanks for the book suggestion! Somehow I missed out on the entire Buffy phenomenon (she admitted, uncoolly) but would love to learn what linguistics contributions can be attributed to it.

Bryan-- Thanks for your comments as well.  I was trying to see if my new understanding would still hold up as an example of unexpected modernity, and it didn&#039;t...  Regarding your theory about intensifying &quot;or&quot;, I&#039;m not sure I&#039;m following.  I agree about the &quot;do X or I&#039;ll do Y&quot; structure being an &quot;if(not)/then&quot;, but I&#039;m not getting how the &quot;or&quot; part helps that.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ben&#8211; Thanks for the book suggestion! Somehow I missed out on the entire Buffy phenomenon (she admitted, uncoolly) but would love to learn what linguistics contributions can be attributed to it.</p>
<p>Bryan&#8211; Thanks for your comments as well.  I was trying to see if my new understanding would still hold up as an example of unexpected modernity, and it didn&#8217;t&#8230;  Regarding your theory about intensifying &#8220;or&#8221;, I&#8217;m not sure I&#8217;m following.  I agree about the &#8220;do X or I&#8217;ll do Y&#8221; structure being an &#8220;if(not)/then&#8221;, but I&#8217;m not getting how the &#8220;or&#8221; part helps that.</p>
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		<title>By: Bryan</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1935</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Nov 2005 13:12:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/archives/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/#comment-1935</guid>
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8216;The way you’d have to say this in normal conversation is “I’ll carbonado your shanks, (like) so [brandishing own rapier]&#8220;. Putting the “so” ahead of the verb would be really unusual.&#8217;<br />
well this may be the way you would put it in normal conversation, but not always the way an elizabethan would. </p>
<p>I had thought it meant as follows:</p>
<p>If you do not draw, I will cut you. </p>
<p>That &#8216;so&#8217; acted as an intensifier but not an intensifier of the carbonado but an intensifier of &#8216;or&#8217;.</p>
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		<title>By: Ben Zimmer</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1925</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben Zimmer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Nov 2005 07:58:30 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Though the Language Log hasn&#039;t taken up this usage of &lt;i&gt;so&lt;/i&gt; as an intensifier, you should check out Michael Adams&#039; book &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0195160339/&quot;&gt;&lt;i&gt;Slayer Slang&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/a&gt;, which gives many examples from &lt;i&gt;Buffy the Vampire Slayer&lt;/i&gt;. &lt;i&gt;Buffy&lt;/i&gt; probably had a fair bit to do with popularizing intensive &lt;i&gt;so&lt;/i&gt;, similar to the show&#039;s penchant for using &lt;i&gt;much&lt;/i&gt; to intensify adjectives (e.g., &quot;Jealous much?&quot;). In both cases, I believe &lt;i&gt;Friends&lt;/i&gt; then further popularized the usage established by &lt;i&gt;Buffy&lt;/i&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Though the Language Log hasn&#8217;t taken up this usage of <i>so</i> as an intensifier, you should check out Michael Adams&#8217; book <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0195160339/"><i>Slayer Slang</i></a>, which gives many examples from <i>Buffy the Vampire Slayer</i>. <i>Buffy</i> probably had a fair bit to do with popularizing intensive <i>so</i>, similar to the show&#8217;s penchant for using <i>much</i> to intensify adjectives (e.g., &#8220;Jealous much?&#8221;). In both cases, I believe <i>Friends</i> then further popularized the usage established by <i>Buffy</i>.</p>
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		<title>By: Eve M.</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1909</link>
		<dc:creator>Eve M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Nov 2005 17:43:31 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Hi Uche!  Yes, now I see that I was leaving out the fact that the context is a play, where you can actually gesture and stuff.  The way you&#039;d have to say this in normal conversation is &quot;I&#039;ll carbonado your shanks, (like) so [brandishing own rapier]&quot;.  Putting the &quot;so&quot; ahead of the verb would be really unusual.

However, I still like the notion of Bill S., tossing his locks like a Valley girl, penning this line...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Uche!  Yes, now I see that I was leaving out the fact that the context is a play, where you can actually gesture and stuff.  The way you&#8217;d have to say this in normal conversation is &#8220;I&#8217;ll carbonado your shanks, (like) so [brandishing own rapier]&#8220;.  Putting the &#8220;so&#8221; ahead of the verb would be really unusual.</p>
<p>However, I still like the notion of Bill S., tossing his locks like a Valley girl, penning this line&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Uche</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1907</link>
		<dc:creator>Uche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Nov 2005 06:20:16 +0000</pubDate>
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nah, I seriously doubt the usage comparison you suggest.  In</p>
<p>&#8220;“he’s so not into you”&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;so&#8221; acts as an intensifying adverb.  In the Lear usage</p>
<p>&#8220;I’ll so carbonado your shanks&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;so&#8221; seems to me to be more of a demonstrative adverb (I&#8217;m not a linguist, so I make no claims about the linguistic rigor of my terms).  Basically:</p>
<p>&#8220;I’ll [in this manner] carbonado your shanks&#8221;</p>
<p>I expect that our spleen-spitting Kent has drawn his own rapier, and uses &#8220;so&#8221; to mean &#8220;this here&#8217;s what I&#8217;ll use to carry out this threat, buster&#8221;.</p>
<p>A more likely modern equivalent IMO would be.  &#8220;I said so&#8221; or &#8220;so let it be done&#8221; or &#8220;knead the dough firmly, so&#8221;.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not only so not a linguist, but I&#8217;m, like, so not a scholar of Shakespeare, so take my point with the deserved skepticism (IOW, don&#8217;t jump on my say-so).</p>
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		<title>By: Eve M.</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1906</link>
		<dc:creator>Eve M.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Nov 2005 02:31:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/archives/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/#comment-1906</guid>
		<description>Heh -- true...  Now to find some way to connect my third calendar to the first two.  Um, to cross-stitch you use needles, which are kind of like swords?  Yeah, that&#039;s the ticket!

By the way, only after I did this whole long post, I suddenly wondered if &quot;so&quot; in this quote is some reference back to &quot;draw&quot;, as in &quot;Draw, you rogue, or I&#039;ll [do so myself and] carbonado your shanks.&quot;  But even that takes a lot of squinting.  Hopefully a Shakespearean scholar will wander by here and explain all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Heh &#8212; true&#8230;  Now to find some way to connect my third calendar to the first two.  Um, to cross-stitch you use needles, which are kind of like swords?  Yeah, that&#8217;s the ticket!</p>
<p>By the way, only after I did this whole long post, I suddenly wondered if &#8220;so&#8221; in this quote is some reference back to &#8220;draw&#8221;, as in &#8220;Draw, you rogue, or I&#8217;ll [do so myself and] carbonado your shanks.&#8221;  But even that takes a lot of squinting.  Hopefully a Shakespearean scholar will wander by here and explain all.</p>
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		<title>By: Micah Dubinko</title>
		<link>http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/comment-page-1/#comment-1905</link>
		<dc:creator>Micah Dubinko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Nov 2005 00:49:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.xmlgrrl.com/blog/archives/2005/11/07/unexpectedly-modern/#comment-1905</guid>
		<description>Carbonado? Perhaps Atkins-tips aren&#039;t such a recent formulation either! -m</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carbonado? Perhaps Atkins-tips aren&#8217;t such a recent formulation either! -m</p>
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